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Fax> But yeah, GI and Dip may become one, and Search->Awareness, DD -> Dungeoneering, OL -> Legerdemain ==A PLAN!== four tiers of skill training *Untrained: d20+mod+int *Apprentice: d20+hv+mod+int *Journeyman: d20+hv+mod+mod+int *Master: d20+hv+mod+mod+int plus special skill functions (like epic uses of skills?) Skill sets make you Apprentice. Overlap makes you Journemyan. You are trained in the skill sets provided by your class and in one bonus skill per point of INT modifier, and untrained in all other skills. ==NekoIncardine PROPOSAL== Fax has cited dissatisfaction with two different ideas: * Skill points being largely as-is, except for multitraining synergies replacing skill-to-skill ones. * Skill points ceasing to be, in favor of being "trained" in x skills, rank = Hero Value + 3. Neither quite works, but both work ''in some cases''. My proposal is that this, like how stats are rolled, is a GM option - they can pick either, or let their players pick either. All skill lines are formatted as follows: '''Skills:''' A Wizard is trained in the Mage skill set and chooses one other. If using Skill Points, a Wizard gains 2+INT skill points per level, and are trained in the Scribe skill set.''' Some people will prefer one road over the other, and simply using ranks preserves more compatibility with general 3.5, which seems to be at least somewhat desirable. From a play standpoint, the point-based method is better for being really good at a few thins, while the training method can be better for having a diverse skill set. Another alternative might be that classes get their skill arrays on the rankless scheme, and then get a FEW skill points to toss on top? Something like: * If the skill is trained once, you add your Hero Value, up to your Hero Value in ranks, and the modifier. * If the skill is trained ''more than'' once, you add your Hero Value, up to your Hero Value in ranks, and the modifier, +1 for each additional time trained. * If the skill is untrained, you add up to half your Hero Value in ranks, and the modifier. ==Fax Proposal== A trained/untrained system. You are trained in the skill sets provided by your class and in one bonus skill per point of INT modifier, and untrained in all other skills. When using an untrained skill, you roll 1d20+ability modifier+Int modifier. When using a trained skill, you roll 1d20+Hero Value+ability modifier+Int modifier. You can become trained in skills through multiclassing or the Skill Knowledge feat. ==Gral Proposal== A Trinary system. When you start out, you choose X trained skills. You can exchange a trained skill for two skills that are "half-trained" (needs a better name). * A trained Skill gives you 1d20 + Ability modifier + Int modifier + Hero Value + 3 * A "Half-trained" Skill gives you 1d20 + Ability modifier + Int modifier + Hero value * An Untrained Skill gives you 1d20 + Ability modifier + Int modifier This version is meant to address the problem some have, showing something you aren't necessarily Great at, but decent at. "Half-Trained" would count as trained for all skill purposes (Unless Fax finds something to legitimately limit that on). ==ShneekeyTheLost Proposal== Similar in concept to the first option, in that you have skill sets which the character gains access to through classes. However, these skill sets remain fixed as long as you stay in the class (unless you spend a feat to get more). Where it differs, however, is in implementation. Making a skill check is a level check. Thus a level 4 Rogue using the Disable Device skill he picked up from the skill set would roll 1d20+4. Multiclassing is handled as follows: If you choose a new class, you must choose skills to associate with that class, from the skill sets available to that new class. Thus, a Rogue4 wants to take a level in Sorcerer, he would have to choose new skill sets based on what a Sorcerer has access to. If he wishes to make a skill check based on his Rogue skills, he would check against Level 4, if he wished to check against one of his new Sorcerer skills, he would check against a Level 1. If the class you are taking also has access to skillsets you already possess, and you wish to choose those skills as associated with that class, then the classes stack for the level check. Thus if a Rogue4/Ranger3 took a skillset from BOTH classes which included Hide, he would be considered to be Level 7 for that skill check. If, however, he used Disable Device, which was taken as a Rogue but not as a Ranger, it would be as Level 4. '''Inspiration Points''' Inspiration Points are used to boost a given skill check for a single action in a given encounter. Inspiration Points will *ONLY* affect a single die roll, and will not affect further die rolls, even if an effect would indicate that it uses all modifiers of the previous die roll. Each class gains Inspiration Points, although at different rates. 'Skillmonkey' classes gain them the fastest, at a rate of 2/level. 'Hybrid Skillmonkey' classes gain them at 1/level. Classes which are not particularly skillful gain them at a rate of 1 at 1st level, and an additional point at every odd level. Each successive bonus costs an increasing amount of inspiration points. Say your first +1 is only 1 point. Then a +2 is 2 points, a +3 is 4 points, a +4 is 8 points, and a +5 is 16 points. And it caps there at +5. '''Talents''' Talents are special skill options which are available specifically to classes whose specialty are skills. They either provide an additional benefit to using a skill, allow the skill to be used easier, or in a slightly different manner. Talents are usable once per encounter, but you may spend (?)Inspiration Points to refresh one Talent as a standard action. These are similar in concept to Skill Tricks, although probably different in execution. Skillmonkey classes gain Talents at given levels (1st level for the first Talent, every three levels thereafter?). No other classes gain Talents.
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